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Exclusive David Brin Text for Citizens and Topic for #91: Transhumanism Plus More on Brin’s “Existence” (Without Brin)

February 28, 2014 by Mark Linsenmayer 8 Comments

CrystalsWe had a very pleasant recording with David Brin this last Tuesday, and he gave us permission in the course of that to post for our Citizenry an exclusive draft of a philosophical work he's hashing out at present: "Sixteen Modern Questions About Humanity’s Relationship With its Creator in the Context of an Age of Science," a whopping 60+ page essay that considers such questions as:

What debt or obedience does a "creation" owe to its creator?
Must we be coerced, or bribed, to do what is right?
Are people basically frail, and are ideas intrinsically dangerous?
What is our purpose?

...And 12 more that sound less cool when just written down out of context like that! To access this document, become a PEL Citizen and go to the Free Stuff page. He would appreciate feedback on this from the philosophically educated, so I'll ask that you record any such as comments on this blog post, and I'll point David to it as a big, unorganized mass around when ep. #91 comes out. Needless to say, folks that download this should not repost it anywhere or send it to friends. If you do, your avatar will not be included in the crystal spheres that represent our only shot at immortality and inter-stellar travel!

Regarding our recording with him, as with Owen Flanagan, our guest had so much to say about such a wide range of topics that we found when we were done that a) we had not actually talked about a lot of the philosophical issues involved with his book, and b) we had done much more listening to him than talking ourselves and so wanted to get a little more expressive bang for our 600-page buck.

Also, we were very glad to introduce on the podcast the fabulous Brian Casey, brother of Dylan and of my wife Kim, as a guest participant, and we'd like to hear more from him about Brin (whose books Brian is very familiar with; he's the one who put me onto Startide Rising maybe a decade ago, which was one of the books that convinced me that it was worth my time to read science fiction as an adult) and about the relationship between philosophy and science. Like Dylan, he's got a science PhD--in astronomy--but though he talks a lot about philosophical things with us, he's generally been wary of and has avoided academic philosophy.

So for episode 91, we've planned another call for next Tuesday (with Brian Casey but without David Brin himself), and to help focus our discussion of the ethics and other philosophical issues involved in potentially crazy-ass technological advancement (like genetically engineering other animals to be as smart as we are, creating full artificial intelligence, and putting copies of our minds into computers), we asked our Facebook group and came up with a paper for us all to read by then:

"Why I Want to Be a Posthuman When I Grow Up," by Nick Bostrom, Oxford University (2006). While that is likely all we'll have time to read as a group, I've tried to start listening to some other podcasts related to this topic and scanning the web, so feel free to recommend additional sources for us to look at for this or future related episodes. (OK, realistically, this is the only time we'll get to transhumanism within the foreseeable future... we may well do one on "the singularity" though.) Or, just share your thoughts on this topic by replying to this post (thereby mixing up your replies with those about Brin on religion in an entertaining and possibly serendipitous morass).

-Mark Linsenmayer

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Filed Under: General Announcements Tagged With: David Brin, philosophy of religion, philosophy podcast, transhumanism

Comments

  1. phil says

    March 3, 2014 at 8:45 am

    I think in the future you guys should do a few more on transhumanist philosophy, especially in the context of political philosophy (for example the debate around regulation of transhumanist technologies). It is a topic close to my heart, one that is very fertile ground for philosophical examination. It of course relates intimately with existentialist themes, so your recent foray into existentialism provides a good backdrop for it.

    Reply
    • Mark Linsenmayer says

      March 3, 2014 at 2:19 pm

      Hi, Phil, please elaborate: how is this related to existentialism. Do you have any additional reading recommendations? I’m honestly a little at a loss re. this and other “contemporary ethics” issues; it’s not what we tend to cover on the podcast, and I’m not convinced that we’ll have all that much interesting/unique to add to the debates, so I’d appreciate any insights you may have.

      Reply
    • dmf says

      March 3, 2014 at 6:29 pm

      what is a transhumanist technology and who is regulating them (or not)?

      Reply
  2. MikeE says

    March 26, 2014 at 7:15 pm

    I think that ‘transhuman’ is a bit of a misnomer. Any tools that we have created, in a way,
    make us trans (beyond?) human. e.g. stone tools, writing implements and spectacles.

    Somebody like Stephen Hawking would be a good example of what is more commonly meant
    by the term, and apparently someone is trying to develop a brain implant device that could allow
    him to continue communicating as allegedly he has lost his previous ability to do so. I heard,
    somewhere, that this was already done but I can’t confirm this. I also heard that such was needed
    due to him losing the use of his fingers, but elsewhere I’ve read that he communicated somehow
    by eye movements. Regardless, such technology is quite beneficial and certainly improves
    medical science but I don’t think we lose our humanity through any of it.

    One of the better philosophers who are into this is Max More, and I particularly liked this talk:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWILNddsatA

    Some other non-philosophers have some good ideas, such as Steve Omohundro and Peter
    Diamandis, but I have a little personal trouble dealing with the likes of Ray Kurzweil and
    even Michio Kaku, the former being a little too optimistic regarding things like immortality and
    the latter somewhat misrepresenting the implications of research and development.

    As a last word, I have to say that I am bewildered when I hear some of the advocates state their
    beliefs that if their brains were fully scanned and copied to a machine, with their useless (cough)
    human bodies then disposed of, then this new replicant would then be them as long as it
    contained all their memories, personality, etc.
    My own sense of personal identity totally disagrees.
    I suppose it is just the Star Trek transporter problem all over again.

    Reply

Trackbacks

  1. Partially Examined Life Ep. 90: Guest David Brin on Sci-Fi | The Partially Examined Life Philosophy Podcast | A Philosophy Podcast and Blog says:
    March 26, 2014 at 12:22 pm

    […] interjections by Mark, Seth, Dylan, and also Brian Casey), we recorded a follow-up without him; go read about that and access Brin’s philosophy of religion essay. Be sure to listen to Mark’s introduction, and then read more about the topic and get the […]

    Reply
  2. Conversation vs. Crossfire (Philosophy, Arrogance, and the David Brin Episode) | The Partially Examined Life Philosophy Podcast | A Philosophy Podcast and Blog says:
    March 28, 2014 at 9:32 am

    […] out in reasonably thorough detail. He’s not your garden variety advocate of scientism, as he has written some philosophy himself. I think his attraction to philosophy is somewhat less mindfucked than many of ours who went […]

    Reply
  3. Partially Examined Life Ep. 91: Transhumanism + More on Brin | The Partially Examined Life Philosophy Podcast | A Philosophy Podcast and Blog says:
    March 29, 2014 at 3:18 pm

    […] Mark, Seth, Dylan, and Brian Casey are rejoined by Wes to reflect on ep. 90′s discussion with David Brin and figure out how his project is related to transhumanism. While you’ll get a more thorough introduction to transhumanism from Rationally Speaking or many other web sources, we did confront Bostrom’s argument that extending our lives and enhancing our IQ and emotional range would be good, and human-all-too-human fun was had. Read more about the topic and get the text. […]

    Reply
  4. Talking Back to David Brin (on Scientism, the Self, and Philosophy) | The Partially Examined Life Philosophy Podcast | A Philosophy Podcast and Blog says:
    May 3, 2014 at 10:27 am

    […] I had another opportunity to close the circle. He had given us (for Citizen perusal) a philosophy text he was writing for our philosophical feedback. Now, since NO ONE among our Citizens seemed inclined […]

    Reply

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